Sunday, June 15, 2008

Faith and Science?

"I believe in Christianity as I believe that the sun has risen: not only because I see it, but because by it I see everything else." - C. S. Lewis
A rather interesting forwarded email. Feel free to comment!



'Let me explain the problem science has with Jesus Christ.' The atheist
professor of philosophy pauses before his class and then asks one of his
new students to stand.

'You're a Christian, aren't you, son?'

'Yes sir,' the student says.

'So you believe in God?'

'Absolutely.'

'Is God good?'

'Sure! God's good.'

'Is God all-powerful? Can God do anything?'

'Yes.'

'Are you good or evil?'

'The Bible says I'm evil.'

The professor grins knowingly. 'Aha! The Bible!' He considers for a
moment.

'Here's one for you. Let's say there's a sick person over here and you
can cure him. You can do it. Would you help him? Would you try?'

'Yes sir, I would.'

'So you're good...!'

'I wouldn't say that.'

'But why not say that? You'd help a sick and maimed person if
you could. Most of us would if we could. But God doesn't.'

The student does not answer, so the professor continues. 'He
doesn't, does he? My brother was a Christian who died of cancer, even
though he prayed to Jesus to heal him How is this Jesus good? Hmmm? Can
you answer that one?'

The student remains silent.

'No, you can't, can you?' the professor says. He takes a sip of
water from a glass on his desk to give the student time to relax.

'Let's start again, young fella Is God good?'

'Er...yes,' the student says.

'Is Satan good?'

The student doesn't hesitate on this one. 'No.'

'Then where does Satan come from?'

The student : 'From...God...'

'That's right. God made Satan, didn't he? Tell me, son. Is there
evil in this world?'

'Yes, sir.'

'Evil's everywhere, isn't it? And God did make everything,
correct?'

'Yes.'

'So who created evil?' The professor continued, 'If God created
everything, then God created evil, since evil exists, and according to
the principle that our works define who we are, then God is evil.'

Without allowing the student to answer, the professor continues:
'Is there sickness? Immorality? Hatred? Ugliness? All these terrible
things, do they exist in this world?'

The student: 'Yes.'

'So who created them?'

The student does not answer again, so the professor repeats his
question. 'Who created them? There is still no answer. Suddenly the
lecturer breaks away to pace in front of the classroom. The class is
mesmerized.

'Tell me,' he continues onto another student. 'Do you believe in
Jesus Christ, son?'

The student's voice is confident: 'Yes, professor, I do.'

The old man stops pacing. 'Science says you have five senses you
use to identify and observe the world around you. Have you ever seen
Jesus?'

'No sir. I've never seen Him'

'Then tell us if you've ever heard your Jesus?'

'No, sir, I have not.'

'Have you ever actually felt your Jesus, tasted your Jesus or
smelt your Jesus? Have you ever had any sensory perception of Jesus
Christ, or God for that matter?'

'No, sir, I'm afraid I haven't.'

'Yet you still believe in him?'

'Yes.'

'According to the rules of empirical, testable, demonstrable
protocol, science says your God doesn't exist. What do you say to that,
son?'

'Nothing,' the student replies. 'I only have my faith.'

'Yes, faith,' the professor repeats. 'And that is the problem
science has with God. There is no evidence, only faith.'

The student stands quietly for a moment, before asking a
question of his own. 'Professor, is there such thing as heat?'

'Yes,' the professor replies. 'There's heat.'

'And is there such a thing as cold?'

'Yes, son, there's cold too.'

'No sir, there isn't.'

The professor turns to face the student, obviously interested.
The room suddenly becomes very quiet. The student begins to explain.

'You can have lots of heat, even more heat, super-heat,
mega-heat, unlimited heat, white heat, a little heat or no heat, but we
don't have anything called 'cold'. We can hit up to 458 degrees below
zero, which is no heat, but we can't go any further after that. There is
no such thing as cold; otherwise we would be able to go colder than the
lowest -458 degrees. Every body or object is susceptible to study when
it has or transmits energy, and heat is what makes a body or matter have
or transmit energy. Absolute zero (-458 F) is the total absence of heat.
You see, sir, cold is only a word we use to describe the absence of
heat. We cannot measure cold. Heat we can measure in thermal units
because heat is energy. Cold is not the opposite of heat, sir, just the
absence of it.'

Silence across the room. A pen drops somewhere in the classroom,
sounding like a hammer.

'What about darkness, professor. Is there such a thing as
darkness?'

'Yes,' the professor replies without hesitation. 'What is night
if it isn't darkness?'

'You're wrong again, sir. Darkness is not something; it is the
absence of something. You can have low light, normal light, bright
light, flashing light, but if you have no light constantly you have
Nothing and it's called darkness, isn't it? That's the meaning we use to
define the word. In reality, darkness isn't. If it were, you would be able
to make darkness darker, wouldn't you?'

The professor begins to smile at the student in front of him.
This will be a good semester. 'So what point are you making, young man?'

'Yes, professor. My point is, your philosophical premise is
flawed to start with, and so your conclusion must also be flawed.'

The professor's face cannot hide his surprise this time.
'Flawed? Can you explain how?'

'You are working on the premise of duality,' the student
explains. 'You argue that there is life and then there's death; a good
God and a bad God. You are viewing the concept of God as something
finite, something we can measure. Sir, science can't even explain a
thought. It uses electricity and magnetism, but has never seen, much
less fully understood either one. To view death as the opposite of life
is to be ignorant of the fact that death cannot exist as a substantive
thing. Death is not the opposite of life, just the absence of it.'

'Now tell me, professor. Do you teach your students that they
evolved from a monkey?'

'If you are referring to the natural evolutionary process, young
man, yes, of course I do'

'Have you ever observed evolution with your own eyes, sir?'

The professor begins to shake his head, still smiling, as he
realizes where the argument is going. A very good semester, indeed.

'Since no one has ever observed the process of evolution at work
and cannot even prove that this process is an on-going endeavor, are you
not teaching your opinion, sir? Are you now not a scientist, but a
preacher?'

The class is in uproar. The student remains silent until the
Commotion has subsided.

'To continue the point you were making earlier to the other
student, let me give you an example of what I mean.'

The student looks around the room. 'Is there anyone in the class
who has ever seen the professor's brain?' The class breaks out into
laughter.

'Is there anyone here who has ever heard the professor's brain,
felt the professor's brain, touched or smelled the professor's brain? No
one appears to have done so. So, according to the established rules of
empirical, stable, demonstrable protocol, science says that you have no
brain, with all due respect, sir. So if science says you have no brain,
how can we trust your lectures, sir?'

Now the room is silent. The professor just stares at the
student, his face unreadable.

Finally, after what seems an eternity, the old man answers. 'I
guess you'll have to take them on faith.'

'Now, you accept that there is faith, and, in fact, faith exists
with life,' the student continues. 'Now, sir, is there such a thing as
evil?'

Now uncertain, the professor responds, 'Of course, there is. We
see it everyday. It is in the daily example of man's inhumanity to man.
It is in the multitude of crime and violence everywhere in the world.
These manifestations are nothing else but evil.'

To this the student replied, 'Evil does not exist sir, or at
least it does not exist unto itself. Evil is simply the absence of God.
It is just like darkness and cold, a word that man has created to describe
the absence of God.

God did not create evil. Evil is the result of what happens when
man does not have God's love present in his heart. It's like the cold
that comes when there is no heat or the darkness that comes when there
is no light.'

The professor sat down.

13 comments:

KY KHOR said...

i like it!

=chuanguan= said...

no offence of wat i am saying..i have my point of view as well..

u c..
'And is there such a thing as cold?'

'Yes, son, there's cold too.'

'No sir, there isn't.'

if there is no cold..u wouldnt neo wat is heat...u get wat i mean? it's because ppl differentiate things by comparison.

so..if there are no satan..i believe god would exist in our mind..things go by ying and yang..

if there wouldnt have darkness...wat is light then..can u explain with it?

'Have you ever observed evolution with your own eyes, sir?

yes..of cos scientis do..they have those remaining billion years old skull left by them to be examine..if not they wouldnt come out wit that theory..so which mean u cant accept da fact tat dinosour exist if u din c any now?

So if science says you have no brain,
how can we trust your lectures, sir?'

eventually, if u open up his brain..u can smell, feel, touch, even eat it if u wan..

'Evil does not exist sir, or at
least it does not exist unto itself. Evil is simply the absence of God.

nah..many man do not dare to do bad because they fear god..not they neo it is wrong..
it just like..da law bound a person movement..wat if 1 day, da law states that laughing is a crime..yet..u have to obey it..in the end..time flows, laughing is a devil and wrong doing..hhaha..

so..pls reforward my thought to the forwarded person..haha...
lastly, no offence..alrite..i have my faith too...

specialhuman said...

kykhor:

hahaha. I like it too.

chuanguan:

aiyo u got the whole point wrong already.

U r still stuck in the concept of duality. U see, as the student in this story explained:

Death is not something. It's the absence of life. Now u got it? Cold doesn't exist which means:

U cannot make something cold by adding coldness in it, instead, u extract heat from the thing and then it becomes cold.

If there's darkness, can u turn off the darkness when u go into a room? No! U can only turn on the light right? Ying and Yang is a concept of duality. Get urself clear about what's duality first.

The brain thing is just a metaphor. There're lotsa stuffs that we can't observe without advance technology, eg, electromagnetic waves. Tell the scientist 500 years ago bout EM waves they'll laugh their asses off. If EM waves, such simple things needed advanced technology to be observed, how bout GOD who is the almighty all powerful GOD, can we even observe HIM?

The evolution thing: No u were wrong. Darwin came out with the evolution theory b4 he dug out any artifacts. It was just a theory and it intrigued people about it and they did all kind of researches to prove it. Some kinda matched the theory but some kinda dismissed it. Eg, the foot print of human coexisted with the foot print of dinosaur. Google it up.

U got the point wrong: What the student tried to say was - not only things that we can observe and sense exist. Hope u get the point right.

It's not just about law-abide and stuffs about evil. We know evil because we have conscience. Apparently human being is the only creature on earth that has conscience: we feel bad about things that we do.

Eg, breaking the law to do something right often happens and we don't feel bad about it. Why? Simply because we have our own measurement of conscience in our heart. It's not the law that shapes our conscience, it's human conscience that shapes the law. Don't invert it. Lincoln freed the black and changed the rule. Why? because of conscience. Seeing how Myanmar government mistreat their people, we will feel angry about it.

Do u see the ants or the monkey or the whale or the dolphin setting up laws for their own species? No, simply because they have no conscience.

Anyway to further elaborate, the conscience that we have are corrupted as in our heart, God is absence and our freewill lead us to our own desire which sometimes may kill of our conscience.

Last but not least, God is not something that exist in our mind, HE exists. By not feeling His presence doesn't mean He's not there.

Just my 2 cents.

=chuanguan= said...

crapz..i am owned..dun wana argue wit u at here..c u in msn only talk..lolz...

specialhuman said...

pwned or owned????!?! Write properly a....lol

Niel said...

2 Corinthians 5:7
We live by believing, not by seeing.

Guess that is the only way for us Christians to live and walk with the Lord our God...

P/S apa pawn dan own? nak dota ke ni xD ?!

Anonymous said...

hohoho... cool...

specialhuman said...

niel:

lol. yup. It's too superficial to only believe the things we see.

and:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pwn

anonymous:

Yeah. It's cool

Anonymous said...

The thing is, plz kae vin, PLEASE, stop all ur christianity stories or ur forwarded mails regarding Christianity, Jesus... Chuan Guan, no nid talk or argue wif him, pointless...

=chuanguan= said...

yeah..sure...hahahaha..u rockz

Anonymous said...

nice story...
and to the anonymous up there.. y do u ask kaevin to stop.. about his.. christianity stories?
i guess u r not a christian.. well, i m not too.. but u should be able to learn smth from such a story i guess?
that is kaevin's belief or faith or whatever u call that.. and obviously that is his right to post whatever he wants on his own blog.. u can choose to complain him talking about christianity all the time... u can choose not to read any of his post regarding christianity.. he can choose to continue his stories TOO.. LOL...

joe wee chuah said...

i've seen this story before, and i reckon it's pretty good. Although many times we can really argue science with faith. but one thing for sure, u cannot believe there is evil without believing there is good. same thing when it comes to spiritual things like this, u cannot believe there's satan or devil or watever people call it without believing there is a God. unless u're an atheist and u don believe in anything spiritual.

anyway...many scientist have been trying to prove the bible wrong but end up believing it, amazing aint it?
and about evolution and creation or intelligent design? there's a whole new argument there...which im pretty interested in....

specialhuman said...

anonymous 12:10 AM:

Sorry the thing that i posted provoked u but seriously u have to the right to not read them and I guess u wouldn't be so mad afterall?

chuanguan:

yala yala. Now u got one helluva supporter. lol

anonymous 12:44 AM:

It's pretty common for people trolling in a blog. Bear with it k?

joe wee:

Yeah, waiting for u to post urs. ;)